New Amp/Sub build

[JKrepps]

Good day,

Start off:

Vehicle: 2006 Scion xB
Amp: nine.5
Current Sub: 2x 13Kv.2
Speakers: 6000sv.2 ordered, not installed yet, debating a custom 3-way component

After much discussion, I decided to go with a sealed set up for this first installation. This was primarily because of space and my lack of skills/experience, so keeping things simple is ideal. I have never been one who is happy with mounting an amp to the sub box, so one of my goals was to keep them separate, even if they had some contact. Separate also gives me a lot more future proofing (since it will be a lot easier to build a box that fits in the available space and slip it in rather than having to rebuild the entire amp rack and box (; ) as well as being able to pull it out to access the spare tire/storage box if I ever need to.

So here are the pics of 'current progress', and questions/request will be added at the end (ignore the mess! (; ):

I had to buy most of my supplies for this build, and a lot of it was 'guess-work' of what I would need. In retrospect (or for next time), I will buy a few more clamps, and a couple of those will be longer than the 36" I bought). I only got 2 36", 2 6", and a few small C clamps. A few more long 36"+ clamps would have helped a lot on a few of the sides.

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/72607Stock001800x600.jpg

Plenty of glue used (when the box was assembled completely, I went through and added a thick bead to every corner just to make sure it was sealed).

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/72607Stock006800x600.jpg

Amp rack. This will sit right up against the back seat.

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/72607Stock008800x600.jpg

Side view of the rack. Where wires and such are is where the sub box will sit.

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/72607Stock011800x600.jpg

Back side of the amp rack, I am hoping the two braces will be strong enough for supporting the amp and wiring. Back board is 3/4 MDF, sides/frame is 1/2.

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/72607Stock012800x600.jpg

And finally, a test fit and starting to try and figure out the best layout. To give an idea of size, the back board of the amp rack is 12" x 37", on the right side of the amp is the KnuKonceptz.com 1/0 ground distro block, and on the left is the 0/1 3-way power distro block. Not a small amp, and I fully understand why I've seen it 'named' the surfboard. The nine.1 I got is tiny by comparison.

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/72607Stock013800x600.jpg


Now for a couple of questions or help requests.

I am trying to figure out the 'best' or most attractive possible layout I can. If I put the amp dead center, (about where it is in the picture), the wiring will be difficult since I am using 1/0 cable. I am not sure how it will look offset, not to mention (err, to mention, I guess), that it will make accessing the filters a bit more of a pita, though not a huge one.

Second is the finish. I am leaning heavily toward a 'truck liner' finish for durability and ease of cleaning. I basically live in the middle of a national forest, which means a ton of dirt, plus this being my only vehicle atm, I will inevitably put bags or whatnot back there, so the easy cleanup of that finish is a perk. Can anyone give reason this is a bad idea, or less than ideal?

If I am missing anything or if you have a tip, trick, suggestion, please feel free to speak up. And a big thank you to everyone who has offered me help so far in this project.

[Nebster]

imho mount the blocks to the back and then put a beauty panel or gromet all the holes. i think thats the best way of doing it. the truck liner would be a great idea and would look good.

[JKrepps]

I am starting to think you may be right about mounting them to the back, just need to figure out the spacing/looks. I am planning to do a beauty board over the amp so you just see the center. If my measurements are right (ok, if I am honest it's more like 'if I am lucky' ) a 1/2" board + finish will fit perfectly over the amp.

Thanks for the feedback, Nebster.

[slamminxb]

dude what are your thoughts on how to install the sub box and the rack ie some pics of a dry install. if ya dont mind sir

[JKrepps]

Slammin,

For my build, in the last pic the box and amp rack are reversed, the amp rack sits on a base board that is cut out to fit as close as is reasonable. Then the sub box fits in at the back with the subs firing up. At the moment, the box is super snug when the hatch is closed.

At the moment the box is torn apart so I can run wires, so I can't really fit in (and like a tard I forgot to take pics of that when I had it in). As soon as the wiring is run and the car is rebuilt I will get some dry fit pics posted.

Tomorrow I will be starting paint/bed liner, wires run, and hoping to finish the computer case.

Oh, and I forgot to add, I picked up a couple of Satin Binding Posts (http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=091-1247
) for wiring. I think they will look pretty good.

[slamminxb]

sounds good bro can't wait to see some more pics. also i dont know about other guys in here. wood glue is great. also if you are planing on puting some major pressure in there try to go over all your seams with liquid nail. it will make your box even stronger for sure. just my .2 $

[JKrepps]

A few more pics of progress, plus some 'dry fit' for slammin. A few lessons learned (ok, a lot of them), a few problems I can see in this build that I will need to fix for next one, and a good deal still to go. hoping to get the finish on the box and rack tomorrow, plus the computer install.


http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/10112007Ampandboxbuild015800x600.jpg

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/10112007Ampandboxbuild013800x600.jpg

Can see one of the problems, the back seat is not even all the way across, and the base board is very rough cut, next time I will put more time into getting that done right.
http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/10112007Ampandboxbuild017800x600.jpg

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/10112007Ampandboxbuild021800x600.jpg

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/10112007Ampandboxbuild019800x600.jpg

[JKrepps]

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/10112007Ampandboxbuild016800x600Cro.jpg

[_Keith_]

One problem I see is the amp rack touching the seat.... This keeps the amp harder to cool.. think about putting 2 pull fans on one side and make 2 holes on the other for air to flow through (this is if you are gonna seat it (plexi the front) ) if you dont seal it put 2 push fans... one on each side... pushing in.

Also with everything so tight and touching... looks like it touches the back hatch too? thats gonna be hard to do a beaty board across the top...


And im with Gub... Ben.... Just bunch holes for the wires to come through... and into the amp... make em look clean and nice... do the block on the back or on the bottom board closer to the amp rack...


Also..... LESS GLUE! more silicone as a final prep! and I hope glue isnt the only thing holding all that together... you need screws or brad nails!

[slamminxb]

looks good for the most part. yeah that amp will be very hot if you drive it hard. fans are great for that just pay attention to the fans some create noise in the rca jacks. also that looks like a large box whats the internal cf? and what cf do your subs require sealed?

[JKrepps]

Thanks for the suggestions, Keith. It does currently touch the back hatch, and that is one of the things I will be working on for the next iteration.

I think I am going to agree with you all and just put the power/ground blocks on the back.

I was originally going to go with silicone to seal the box, but after reading about issues with the fumes causing problems with foam speaker surrounds, I decided to try a glue-sealed box. (I should be honest and add that it also has to do with my own impatience to get this first project done, which would have driven me nuts waiting days for the silicone to fully cure for safety. If my next box is not fiberglass, I will more fully explore the risks/benefits of silicone for sealing)

Lots and lots of brad nails, in addition to the glue.

Thanks for the comments and suggestions!

[JKrepps]

looks good for the most part. yeah that amp will be very hot if you drive it hard. fans are great for that just pay attention to the fans some create noise in the rca jacks. also that looks like a large box whats the internal cf? and what cf do your subs require sealed?

It's actually pretty small, slightly over 1 cubic foot per chamber.

Heat is an issue I am going to have to deal with. If I can find a relay I will probably wire up 2 80mm fans, originally I was only going to be doing a cover one each side, so the wiring won't be visible, but if I do active cooling I may have to do a full cover for the fans to be very effective.

Think I will go play with layout now (;

[jwaj2002]

hey when you come down Saturday bring the sub box with you, we'll see what we can do with that while your here

[Luc1f3r]

i have some extra 120mm fans with white LEDs if ya want em...

IMO i would switch the setup, or are your seats gona be down at shows? i would put the amp rack at the hatch and box against the seats, this would also add to better air flow, and prolly allow you to get your seats in their normal positions...

[JKrepps]

Jwaj, sounds like a plan. I am trying to get the basic wiring for the rack done (hoping to finish computer set up tomorrow so I have an ugly, if functional, music/gps setup for the trip (; ).

Orange, I would be VERY interested.

At the moment I am not likely to enter any shows with the current set up, simply because 1) it's my first and I already see too many flaws to be comfortable, and 2) the outside is damn near bone stock still (tint, debadge, and soon will have removed rear wiper are the only 'mods'). As such, I don't mind keeping the seats down for cooling, until I get something better set up.

I am starting to think about the 'next' set up already, but want to finish this one and then figure out where all of my bugs are so I know what to avoid on the next go around.

Oh, and edit to add a clarification, the seats do sit in their normal positions with the current build. It's just that where the mechanism is for the middle seatbelt there is a hump that throws things off.

[Luc1f3r]

ill check to see how many fans i have left should be at least 3 though.

shows are about hanging out and showing off what you got, not bragging about having the best. :cough:nebster:cough: lol.

are you doing a carputer? specs?


Edit: i do like what your doing, im just a more "flashy" person thats why i suggested switching the amp. but for a practical "throw things in the back" car, your setup works MUCH better.

[jwaj2002]

ill check to see how many fans i have left should be at least 3 though.

shows are about hanging out and showing off what you got, not bragging about having the best. :cough:nebster:cough: lol.

are you doing a carputer? specs?


Edit: i do like what your doing, im just a more "flashy" person thats why i suggested switching the amp. but for a practical "throw things in the back" car, your setup works MUCH better.

also if the top of the box is flat like mine is, you can use it as a table for when your at shows, or working on your new building...

[JKrepps]

Yeah, I am going with a carputer,

Mobo: Jetway J7F3E-PB A (w/ 1500Mhz AMD Geode processor)
Ram: 512
HDD: 320gig
GPS: iGuidance 4.0 with a BU-353
LCD: 8" molded into stock radio location

Atm I will be using onboard audio, but if I can fit it in, I will be upgrading to an Audigy 2 ZS PCI card when I get the trim bezel repainted. If that won't fit, i will be looking for a USB option (likely the Turtle Beach Audio Advantage SRM). Future add-ons will likely be rear mount camera, ODB reader/management, etc.

As for shows, did not think of it like that. Have to get a chance to meet more people somehow (;

[JKrepps]

It's flat, but the subs are firing up, so until I build a custom beauty board (with a custom board to protect the subs) I don't think I'll do that ;)

Orange, I'm really torn between flash and 'sleeper' styles. On the one hand, I like the idea of really putting your personality into the vehicle, loud and proud as it were. However, on the other side, I like the concept of just pulling up, looking mostly stock, and not attracting much attention until it counts.

Edit to add: plus, with this being my only current vehicle, I can't take it out of commission for the time to go as wild as I might otherwise. Once I've got the extra cash for a 2nd car or bike, then we'll see where things go (;

[jwaj2002]

I've not taken mine out and you've seen some of the pics of mine haven't you?

[JKrepps]

Just now saw the pics you posted.

[jwaj2002]

of my car?

[JKrepps]

Yeah. Had not seen any pics before.

[Luc1f3r]

my tC is my only car, longest install was my springs... i did however drive around with no gauges in my car for a week, nothing but my drivers seat for about a month and other countless temp conditions...

random question, how old are you?

as really, if you want to get loud you have to go flash just because the box is gona be so large... my stereo has no flash, but gets loud (for me anyway). my car domain is in my sig if you wanna see my system.

[jwaj2002]

heres my car

http://www.scikotics.com/forums/showthread.php?p=449998#post449998

I don't do the cardomain thing

[JKrepps]

Sorry for the delay. Went outside to check something and got distracted (;

I don't mind having the car torn apart, so long as it's drivable (during my sound deadening I driving it stripped down to driver's seat for a couple of weeks). As for audio, I can see your point. I guess it's all in the mood at the time (or the vision/goal at the moment). I'm probably not coherent atm, am a bit fried from the day, will try to clear up intent tomorrow at some point.

(but going to crash until I check out both of your vehicles (; )

[JKrepps]

Sorry for the long delay in updates. I am torn between saying I got a lot done and admitting that it just took time (; Anyway, onto the pictures:

(note: this covers close to a week, and I will admit I was quite remiss about taking a lot of pics. If anyone has any questions, please feel free to post and I will get any requested shots asap. Also, this post is being cross posted to a couple of forums, so please forgive and ignore any 'odd' comments/notes)

One of the major issues to come up was the computer mounting/location. I originally planned to install it in a custom case located in the stock location. Using scavenged/scrap plastic (old/broken clipboards, /cheer recycling), I built a case that was pretty much perfectly sized to fit in the dash location and fit the components well, with a little room for bolts and external wires to safely pass around. What I forgot to account for were the number and rigidness of PC wiring.

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/Part2/10112007Ampandboxbuild005800x600.jpg
http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/Part2/10112007Ampandboxbuild006800x600.jpg

I tried a few variations/tweaks/hacks to create some more room, and pretty much destroyed the nice and clean box I first built (; At this point, I decided to build a box to be placed under the passenger seat. I am not entirely fond of this location, since I know the risks (dirt, feet, food, spilled drinks, moisture, etc etc etc) but the location does give me one HUGE benefit: easy access. Since this is my first carPC, I will be having to access it a lot for upgrades, add-ons, fixes, etc, so a way of getting to the guts quickly, and without having to remove the monitor or tear out the dash is a big benefit to me atm. A definite plan for the future will be relocating the entire PC to the dash, though this may wait until the official 'phase 2' build.

The box is modeled after the eD Passenger Seat SQ10 box, raises the computer about 1" off the floor (avoiding much moisture, food, etc), and is coated on the outside with Dupli-color Truck Bed Liner. DC-DC PSU and motherboard are bolted in; the slot load dvd drive (another benefit of the external box/case is this drive) is braced in and padded using SecondSkin's OverKill to reduce vibrations and noise; and the HDD is mounted to 2 5.25" rails, set on the DVD drive's top pad, then zip tied to the case/brackets (I will be working on a better system for this, but again, easy access for removing the drive is very useful atm).

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/Part2/10112007Ampandboxbuild014800x600.jpg
http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/Part2/10112007Ampandboxbuild013800x600.jpg
http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/Part2/10112007Ampandboxbuild026800x600.jpg
http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/Part2/10112007Ampandboxbuild025800x600.jpg

I should also add that I forgot to take pictures before i put the box in. At the moment, the box is pulled back and the seat is all the way forward. When they are put in the correct locations, the box is only about 1-2" too deep, so that is something to be fixed in the future, but for now it is fine. The DVD drive has a cutout that allows access to the slot load and the eject button. For future versions, I will probably skip the eject button and just use software (or wire a physical switch to the case).

The next major part of the CarPC is the monitor. I originally purchased a trim panel that had already been modded for an 8" Lilliput monitor, but it needed quite a bit of cleanup (and still does). So far, I have used bondo body filler to cover up the IR window/port, and am in the process of sanding/priming the piece before I get it painted.

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/Part2/10112007Ampandboxbuild032800x600.jpg
http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/Part2/10112007Ampandboxbuild029800x600.jpg
http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/Part2/10112007Ampandboxbuild030800x600.jpg

Now to what most people care about, the amp/subs.

A couple of changes to the original build: I trimmed off a bit of the excess that framed the amp, which allows it to sit about 1/2" closer to the seats than before. Originally this was going to be for a beauty board, but with the subs sitting so tight against the hatch, I decided to forgo the beauty board and let the amp sit closer to the seats. The seats still lock in place easily, and I believe I will be wiring 2 120mm fans to blow air onto the baseplate and out the sides for removing heat. I also shaved out an indent or notch to adjust for the middle passenger seatbelt, and the baseplate got evened out at the front, which also gives all of the wiring a bit more room to be passed through.

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/Part2/10112007Ampandboxbuild009800x600.jpg
http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/Part2/10112007Ampandboxbuild008800x600.jpg

(while trimming down the frame, I had a bit of an 'oopsie', should be barely noticeable once I finish the painting and coating)
http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/Part2/10112007Ampandboxbuild010800x600.jpg

Holes cut for the various wires (power/ground/acc on the bottom, 2 for speaker on the top. In retrospect, I should have gone with smaller holes for the speaker wires
http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/Part2/10112007Ampandboxbuild007800x600.jpg

And now for the big jump, I failed to get many, if any, pics of the painting/liner application. Sorry about that, though not very sorry since my camera is still paint-free :)

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/Part2/10112007Ampandboxbuild017800x600.jpg

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/Part2/10112007Ampandboxbuild018800x600-1.jpg

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/Part2/10112007Ampandboxbuild019800x600.jpg

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/Part2/10112007Ampandboxbuild023800x600.jpg

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Pag0/CarPC%20and%20Audio/Part2/10112007Ampandboxbuild024800x600.jpg

A couple of notes:
1) I am going to drop the terminals on the sub box, they sit on either side of the power block, and I am not comfortable them them being there.
2) The amp rack has not been coated yet. On one side, I wish I had done it before I put everything together, but on the other I am really glad I didn't, since I will be drilling a few more holes into the box, and would still like to add a couple of additional supports.
3) No, additional supports have not been done yet (; Still on the 'to-do' list. Likely I will do the truck bed liner and supports when I take the monitor out to have the trim painted.
4) I am fairly shocked, but so far I have not noticed ANY dimming of the headlights, which has been a pleasant surprise. And this is without the big3 being done yet. :beer:

Anyway, that is about it. Atm it is ugly, but the dry fit shows everything to be functional and reasonably good sounding.

Currently on the to-do list:

1) Determine best location for GPS wire to pass through the dash
2) Wire relay and run power for 120mm fans, plus drill holes for them to mount to amp rack
3) Finish rack, both with liner and, hopefully, additional supports., if I can get them located around the wiring path(s) and fan holes. I may also add covers to the side of the rack to hide the wiring on the sides.
4) Pull the subs out and sand out the holes, one of them fits perfectly with only a bit of pressure, while the other one won't seal properly. Thinking i just need to sand for a bit to open it up.
5) pick up some additional Ring terminals for wiring the subs.
6) Finish off the lid for the computer box. Mostly this just means mounting the fan.
7) 1 or 2 additional coats to the sub box. Seeing a few missed spots in the pics now
8) A few other things that I just can't remember atm (;

If there are any questions, feel free to post and I will respond asap!