tC people.. Whos had a blown motor from engine failure

[_Keith_]

Im looking to get info from those of you that have had a blown engine from engine failure, not from over boosting or a/f ratio errors or whatever...

My engine blew with 21,500 miles on it from what I know as bad rings burning oil. They are not warranting my claim. I was told by the B.A.R. to take em to small claims, but if I can prove that thier might be a problem with the engines that it wont even go that far.

So any help from those of you that have had a knocking or a blown engine please let me know!

Heres my email address just take out the space. cali357@ hotmail.com

If you have had a problem please email me the following info.!


Your full name
Year of tC
Address
How many miles on the motor when it happened
What they said caused it
Explain what they said.. did they say it was low on oil or somthing else
Any other info that may be of help to me and others.
All the above info will help with a case im trying to do. Also seems I have others that will be following in my steps once I get my case going.

If you have documantion of your engine getting fixed you may fax it to me if you dont mind... or if you have other important info fax that too. (925) 685 9306

[Krdshrk]

You're not boosted right?

Bring it up with Scion Corporate. You shouldn't have problems. Only people with blown engines i know of are from F/I.

[_Keith_]

You're not boosted right?

Bring it up with Scion Corporate. You shouldn't have problems. Only people with blown engines i know of are from F/I.

Nope stock motor other then a umnitza intake and killerglass... I brought it up my claim was denied.... They are trying to say I abused the car... The fucking cars a widebody and I dont even drive the damn thing anymore... 21,500 miles on a damn 05 and I abuse it? So im taking them to court... Im buying a new motor this weekend, and going from thier.

No oil light came on and no check engine light...

And theres 6 in my area now... 3 S/c and 3 not... im one of the three that are not. All of them blown motors... Started knocking... All lose of oil.

[_Keith_]

As for Scion Corp ive noticed they can careless about this... Ive supported scion since it started. I was one of the first scions auto x in my area. Ive done alot with my scion(s) and I get no support.

[Krdshrk]

This is weird. Do you have anyone in your area that can contact scion corporate? I know several people from the NorthEast (NY) Region and the MD/NE PA region as well...

[EVLTSTR]

I have heard of a few people blowing their motor down here. But it is few and far between. Check the archives of the desert and salt forum on scion life. It may help you.

[_Keith_]

This is weird. Do you have anyone in your area that can contact scion corporate? I know several people from the NorthEast (NY) Region and the MD/NE PA region as well...

Ive talked to Scion corp... its not on them its on Toyota Factory...

[1*BA*RStC07]

What do you mean by "blown" and Toyota has not had a problem with that engine since they put it in the Camry's in 2002. If you changed your oil, there should be no problems with any warranty coverage. Sounds like there may be some parts of the story that are being left out.

[Stu_Gotti]

Yo Keith, give me a call bro!

I'll PM you my number... I have some interesting things to tell you about that for sure.. I blew mine @ about 20K and I know about 4 or 5 that have had the same exact oiling system issue, bearings, etc...

I may help you push this from the East Coast, I have been wanting to fight my issue but haven't had enough backing or proof that there are faulty bearings or tourque specs on the crank, etc.

[Stu_Gotti]

http://www.scionlife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=91056&highlight=saga

That was my thread bro... check it out, I know its long, but I can summarize it for you when you give me a ring.

[_Keith_]

What do you mean by "blown" and Toyota has not had a problem with that engine since they put it in the Camry's in 2002. If you changed your oil, there should be no problems with any warranty coverage. Sounds like there may be some parts of the story that are being left out.


Excuse me?

One thier was no oil build up which proved the oil got changed...

Two the car was burning oil......

Three no oil light or check engine light ever came on and still dont to this day.

Four the car knocks real bad and the cylinder walls are scored.

Five No heavy shavings in the engine

[_Keith_]

What do you mean by "blown" and Toyota has not had a problem with that engine since they put it in the Camry's in 2002. If you changed your oil, there should be no problems with any warranty coverage. Sounds like there may be some parts of the story that are being left out.

Please dont call me a liar when you dont know me.. and dont try and call me out like that.... Im looking for other people with similar problems.. Not people trying to prove me wrong.

[Stu_Gotti]

Metja, there are issues with these motors, if you refer to my ScionLife thread (Although I hate SL haha) there are numerous engines that have experienced similar failures and its not that he's leaving anything out of this story, thats some of the stuff that is happening...

Mine was also slightly linked to poor oil levels, thats evident from the discoloration and burning of the crank and bearings. My bearings spun, cylinder wall was scored, most likely both of them were caused by lack of oil.

[Stu_Gotti]

Please dont call me a liar when you dont know me.. and dont try and call me out like that.... Im looking for other people with similar problems.. Not people trying to prove me wrong.

:up:

[1*BA*RStC07]

I am not calling anyone a liar. I am just saying the Camry's have had no problems so I don't see why they're going wrong in these cars. And if the car was burning oil, you should have approached your dealer when it first started happening. Any premature wear like that would be covered under the 60 month 60k mile powertrain warranty. But then again, we have one dealership in this area who has a horrible reputation with customer satisfaction/ warranty issues, I don't know if the ones in your area are the same. My dealer's standpoint is "why make a customer who is really just expecting what the salesperson told them they're getting when the multi-billion dollar company who made it can fix their mistake?" If you're having problems gettin it covered, talk to the Service Manager and ask him to get ahold of the area rep. The rep's job is to go over any technical problems the dealers in their area are having with any cars and report it to Toyota so they can find a way to improve it. If there are a certain number of vehicles with the exact same issue and the exact same fix, I expect a service bulletin to be out soon approaching this issue. :blink1:

[_Keith_]

The rep has seen it.. hes trying to say ive abused the car....... But when they look at the ecm thiers nothing showing ive abused the car.

This is my car....... He sees the bodywork and doesnt wanna touch it. Thats the problem. Bodywork doesnt affect the engine... My car sits about 1" off the ground on stock suspension right now... Tell me how I abuse it.
http://a111.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/30/l_ed6ff90097e3b6e13af9dc7d56545cee.jpg

[erikarene]

:sorry: 2 go :offtopic: but i had to fight with scion corp for a month just to get my moonroof fixed cause it would not close properly had to keep hitting the close button or push down the wind deflector glass just to close it. 3 weeks after that they finally sent a scion corp engineer to figure out what the problem out. finally the service manager and the engineer found out the sensor was bad and had to replace the tracks. and the reason for not doing a recall on the moonroofs that i know other people had the same problem like i did....heres scion corps answer NO ONE REPORTS the problem....not even the dealership from what i was told.

now to go back :ontopic: i have witnessed these guys engine f**king up for no reason....keith keeps it real....nothing has been really done to his car so they should fix it damn jerks.......i was there when mikes went bad too.

keiths my boy and i back him up and there is no need for him to lie :x:

[hotwheelsrs1]

its ok keith i put a post about our situation on sl, and i got absolutely no help at all, everyone just kept being smart asses with me saying, are u a "streetracer" and crap like that, then they went way off topic, so i gave up on them.

my engine burned up the same way, it was overspun, it started burning oil out of nowhere and just started runnin like garbage, so i took it in and the piston sleeves were like warped, they became an oval shape, so i ended up getting a new block, i havent even gotten my car back yet, but i should get it sometime next week, anyway, this is not an awkward occurance these engines are doing this, there has got to be a reason to link them, maybe as a bad run or whatnot.

my car is an 05, so is keiths, what about all these other guys having troubles?

[cuthbert]

I have followed a bunch of threads on this also, it does seem like the majority of them were from 05. That would make sense if they were from a bad run, with the small amount of cars this has happened on. It might even be a bad batch of parts that wasn't used sequentially, so it might not be isolated to 05's. I tend to think that also because I have talked to people with over 50k on their tc's that drive them hard and haven't had a single issue. Hopefully this gets resolved for you guys/Toyota steps up to the plate.

[_Keith_]

I have followed a bunch of threads on this also, it does seem like the majority of them were from 05. That would make sense if they were from a bad run, with the small amount of cars this has happened on. It might even be a bad batch of parts that wasn't used sequentially, so it might not be isolated to 05's. I tend to think that also because I have talked to people with over 50k on their tc's that drive them hard and haven't had a single issue. Hopefully this gets resolved for you guys/Toyota steps up to the plate.

Thank you...

Seems toyota is picking and choosing who to help and who to not...... Its getting really agravating.

[erikarene]

thats why people call it the stealership not dealership

[Stu_Gotti]

I have got a very solid hunch that there is oiling issues with select tC's from 2005. If anyone actually read my thread from SL on my "Gotti's Saga" I had all the issues you guys are refering too, egg shaped cylinders, spun bearings, scored and scratched crank and bearings, all of those... I think honestly with ZPI telling me that they were having a hard time getting any bearings from Toyota that I have a good idea that there was a bad batch of bearings or the oiling systems in them could have some issues.. either way, there is NO reason that stock, bolt-on and boosted tC's all have exact failures, same bearing failures, etc.

Keith, I got a response back from the Scion guy I know here, and he said that the Scion Customer Experience line SHOULD take all complaints, engine ones as well.. is that who you called?

[_Keith_]

Yea the one on the site...... She said and I quote "I can take your complaint but theres nothing we can do. it rests on the Factory rep."

I mean how can a factory rep say I abused my car when they checked the ecm history and thier was nothing bad. I mean no oil light ever came on and no check engine light! WTF!:fu:

[Stu_Gotti]

Well I assume it'll be on of those things where if they have enough calls about the same issue, then MAYBE they'll take action...

I dunno man.. I'll probably give them a call today or tomorrow and explain my case.

[1*BA*RStC07]

A check engine light will come on for emissions purposes, and just because you have oil pressure, doesn't mean it's equal throughout the engine. The ECM does not record every condition you drive under. It stores freezeframe data from when any kind of warning light comes on, and overall vehicle conditions prior to a crash when your airbags go off/ come close to going off. If you had any kind of work done at the dealer and you didn't pay for it, that dealer HAS to make a warranty claim to Toyota (so they DO know about it) in order to pay the tech who worked on your car. And if you paid half as much as those techs who work at the "stealership" did for schooling, you would be charging the same rates. You don't bitch at your doctor for the high rates you just tell him to fix it. And maybe there is a problem with the 2005's, but like I said there has been none with the Camry's so something must have happened in Japan. Once they get the VIN's from the cars it happened to (and I saw the one's on SL), they have to get some kind of a logic from them. The ones on sl weren't really close to each other... at all. So I'm sure Toyota is just as puzzled as you guys are.

[Stu_Gotti]

That was the issue I wasn't seeing any coorelation between the VIN's I gathered... but the fact remains, even though the Camary hasn't had those issues, doesn't mean it cannot happen here with the Scion tC's. They are the same engine, but built at seperate times.

The ones that I kept record of were all 2005's, all of them had the exact same bearing failure, etc. I think that there is an issue that isn't being addressed yet because there is not enough people letting Toyota know "Hey, what the hell?"...

Frankly the bickering between people on this thread is pointless and should stop now! The threads purpose is not to bash fellow club members, or compare who pays more for school, etc. If your not related to the issue at hand, unless your constructive input has any relation to a failure you've experienced, then lets just keep this clean of all the other non-sense.

Keith and I are not mis-informed about our issues, and I can vouch for what he's been told and others... cause its EXACTLY what all the other tech's have said with these situations. I have a HUGE thread on SL where this has already been debated and several outsiders including NASCAR Techs, and shop mechanics have all given their expert opinions. We all are confused and upset that each of us have had this happen, I will openly admit I beat the living shit out of my car, BUT... when these techs that pay all that money for school couldn't tell me what caused my failure, what happend next is what pissed me off... they immediately resorted to "negligence" so that they wouldn't have to prove shit to me... thats not good business.

So we can make this an arguement about members driving practices with their cars or we can collectively try and figure this shit out and work together to try and help one another out... thats what I intend to do personally.

I've been in contact with the Scion reps I know and they all told me to just keep calling that Scion line and tell them the story, eventually someone will take notice, if not... well then I guess we're just ass out?

Ciao!

[Stu_Gotti]

I dont mean to sound like a prick either, so I apologize if I may have come across like that, but I would LOVE to get to the bottom of this, cause if in fact its something that they've managed to screw up somehow, I want my $2,100+ back from Toyota/Scion!

[hotwheelsrs1]

u know, i work at my local toyota dealerships parts area, and there is a tis report from toyota to show that the part number has changed on the engine blocks for our cars, maybe there is something toyota knows, but there just not fesing up to it, ill c if i cant get a copy of it posted up.

[Stu_Gotti]

:book: See what you can find... thats odd!

[_Keith_]

A check engine light will come on for emissions purposes, and just because you have oil pressure, doesn't mean it's equal throughout the engine. The ECM does not record every condition you drive under. It stores freezeframe data from when any kind of warning light comes on, and overall vehicle conditions prior to a crash when your airbags go off/ come close to going off. If you had any kind of work done at the dealer and you didn't pay for it, that dealer HAS to make a warranty claim to Toyota (so they DO know about it) in order to pay the tech who worked on your car. And if you paid half as much as those techs who work at the "stealership" did for schooling, you would be charging the same rates. You don't bitch at your doctor for the high rates you just tell him to fix it. And maybe there is a problem with the 2005's, but like I said there has been none with the Camry's so something must have happened in Japan. Once they get the VIN's from the cars it happened to (and I saw the one's on SL), they have to get some kind of a logic from them. The ones on sl weren't really close to each other... at all. So I'm sure Toyota is just as puzzled as you guys are.

So when my cars burning oil its not changing my emissions?

[hoss021]

if you want to goto the head of corporate.... Contact Dawn Mercer she heads up Toyota in Cali. Let her know your problem and she'll probably give you some advice. (Just a heads up, she also attends the majority of the Scion Corp events on the East Cost as well, nice lady btw)

[_Keith_]

Thanks.... Ill get everything in order then contact her.

[Stu_Gotti]

Thanks Eddie...

Keith, I'll be attending a Scion Roundtop Event in the Pocono's with a bunch of Corp Executives and Scion folks, I'll also see what I can come up with there...

[_Keith_]

Yea stirr the shit up... I want my shit fixed!

[1*BA*RStC07]

So when my cars burning oil its not changing my emissions?

Not the ones they're worried about. And the short block part number changed for 05-07, but they changed it AGAIN halfway through 07. I'm thinkin it had to be just a bad batch. I'm sorry for you guys that got the unlucky few, but I hope you get your problems fixed. And Keith, did you actually have to pay 2100 dollars to get your shit fixed? I don't understand why they wouldn't cover it. :dload:

[tCTURBONETICS]

I currently have 24,500 miles on my car and noticed that my oil pressure has become lower than it used to be from when i first got the car. I used to run constantly around 60 psi on the freeway, i have always had gauges in my car, but now i am running around 40-45 on the freeway and when i get on it pressure is supposed to increase and it hardley moves. The minimum standard is 10 psi for every 1000rpm anything less is damage. Im wondering wether or not the oil pumps are bad in these motors or not and if you didn't have a gauge to monitor oil psi it could have been the cause, I have some more tests to run still to get to the root of the problem, and an oil pressure light will not come on until 5-10 psi so you could still have been running low and not known it, but I am also turbocharged but only for the last 4500 miles so im not sure if that is the cuase of the problem or not. By the way I am an ASE cert Toyota tech so if you have any q's let me know. My turbo is being rebuilt right now cause it already went out so once the car is up and running again I will let you know what I conclude on.

[Stu_Gotti]

Thanks for the info guys..

Well hopefully when I am at this Roundtop event from the 14th-16th with all those executives, I can find a good POC and hopefully let them hear my case and all the others as well.

Just keep pushing from all directions, eventually somethings gotta give.

[_Keith_]

Bump!

[aaronle06]

bump

[_Keith_]

I updated the first post! please read!

[osu2829]

I recently purchased an 2008 XB which i understand has the same 2.4 liter engine which is used in the TC. At 4900 miles the engine blew, i was told it was an internal issue most likely a bearing, and the entire motor would need to be replaced. The vehicle was in the shop for over three weeks, as they were unable to get a replacement motor. They finally relented after some pushing from me and replaced the entire vehicle. I currently have 1200 miles on the replacement, and as of yet have had no further issues. The dealer told me this was a very unusual situation which they had not seen before.

:wallb:

[_Keith_]

I recently purchased an 2008 XB which i understand has the same 2.4 liter engine which is used in the TC. At 4900 miles the engine blew, i was told it was an internal issue most likely a bearing, and the entire motor would need to be replaced. The vehicle was in the shop for over three weeks, as they were unable to get a replacement motor. They finally relented after some pushing from me and replaced the entire vehicle. I currently have 1200 miles on the replacement, and as of yet have had no further issues. The dealer told me this was a very unusual situation which they had not seen before.

:wallb:

Thank you for the info

[FluffyPuppy]

Hey Keith,
Not sure if you've looked into this, but I was thinking maybe getting some 3rd party involved like some Consumer Affairs, or 7 on your side. maybe have someone with a little more industry pull putting some pressure or some media attention on it might motivate Scion to agree that there is a problem that needs to be addressed. I can see if we have any contacts for anything like that.

[_Keith_]

Bump.. first part of my process has started

[slick07tc]

yea man mine ticks i have a 07 with 17k on it.

[_Keith_]

yea man mine ticks i have a 07 with 17k on it.

Check your oil...

[slick07tc]

oils fine just ticks

[_Keith_]

Well they recieved my letter and have called me twice... Should hear back from them tuesday after the holidays.

[DriverLost]

Been watching the thread, and it sounds to me like an oil journal in the block got missed drilled, or not drilled deep enough, but something along that line. The new block part number, just a handful mid production. Good clues right there.

This stuff happens at the factory, and sometimes they catch it too late. But knowing how Toyota is on not fessing up to any known problems in small quantities. They just play dumb long enough for the handful of claims to go away, or get out of warranty.

Example xB RS 2.0 DC sport muffler tip falling off, and xB RS 3.0 head rest monitors cutting out. There's just a handful of those limited additions, so they don't bother doing a TSB. They know only a handful will come back under warranty, the rest will just become the customers problem.

If you were able to keep the old block, it would be worth it to have an engine builder or two look for that. I would also think higher than normal oil pressure, or clean looking oil at oil changes, may be some clues. Just a guess there.

I did find this on the Tundra forums, but I don't have access to the TSB section TSB ECO16-07 2AZ FE ENGINE BLOCK added 04-06-07 If someone can find out more, it may help you guys out.

[scionxb.org]

I read where the NHSTA is investigating Toyota/Scion for other failed parts, including Moon Roofs on tC's that leak and/or shatter, and other parts on Scions like VSC/ABS Skidcontrol ECU failure.

Once they get a complaint, they start a file and they will investigate and make the Auto Manufacturer fix everything at no cost to the owners.

You can use there search tool to look up recalls, specific part numbers and other info, too.

Maybe it could help...I don't know for sure, but thought I would post it.

Here is the link... http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/ - These people SCARE Auto Makers...big time.

I read an interesting legal case at an office I do computer work for that said people can not sue a dealership...only the manufacturer. The dealership is protected from most legal cases.


:sorry:to hear about this.